This is an interesting project Alex, thank you for doing it and promoting it!
What struck me is that the web today needs -like when it first appeared in 1993- some disciplinary index of resources and projects, could we still say catalogues?
Pioneer digital historian Lynn H. Nelson who created -and with full support by Tim Berners Lee- the World Wide Web Virtual Library History Central Catalogue (today still available as history of the web at vlib.iue.it) was right when he was looking in the ’90 for collaborators worldwide and would still be right that the web needs index of resources, Local Area Search Engines or portals/gateways presenting selected resources in a field. And mirroring the site, finding international volunteers, gathering websites on a common document was already an issue in the ’90. Technologies are changing, some basic needs towards information/documentation are remaining: for example at the European University Institute a portal selecting in OA digital primary sources for the history of Europe: EHPS - primary-sources.eui.eu is in a way presenting DH projects when dealing with the creation of digital primary sources.
So we are missing projects like Intute closed in 2011 (http://www.intute.ac.uk/) and we should have added a global Intute in DH for informing about the field’s developments, a global WWW VL of DH projects, a place where crowdsourcing information worldwide.
Search engines like Google aren’t bibliographies or selected lists of resources and aren’t informing disciplinary about projects. Google founds what you are looking for but is not structuring and presenting information in an intelligent way like archives and libraries do when they have the technology, the time and the staff to do so.
Having access to a selection of DH projects worldwide as an embryo of a database of DH projects is extremely useful indeed and like you said, needs a real lot of work by many volunteers!
Serge Noiret ____________________________________ History Information Specialisthttp://www.eui.eu/Research/Library/ResearchGuides/HistoryAndCivilization/Index.aspx, (Ph.D.) European University Institutehttp://www.eui.eu/
European History Primary Sourceshttp://primary-sources.eui.eu/ serge.noiret@eui.eumailto:serge.noiret@eui.eu @sergenoirethttp://twitter.com/sergenoiret/ sergenoiret.blogspot.ithttp://sergenoiret.blogspot.it/ sergenoiret.tumblr.comhttp://sergenoiret.tumblr.com/
From: globaloutlookdh-l [mailto:globaloutlookdh-l-bounces@uleth.ca] On Behalf Of Alex Gil Sent: 21 June 2014 12:20 To: A list for participants in the ADHO DH Global Outlook Community Subject: [globaloutlookDH-l] AroundDH in 80 Days is live
Hi all,
As promised, I released AroundDH before the summer solstice. Here is the link:
Share with your students and colleagues. This project will hopefully serve as a good introduction to the digital humanities around the world. Stay tuned everyday for a different project!
You can follow updates on Twitter as well with the hashtag #arounddh.
Onwards! A.
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On 23/06/14 12:44, Noiret, Serge wrote:
So we are missing projects like Intute closed in 2011 (http://www.intute.ac.uk/) and we should have added a global Intute in DH for informing about the field’s developments, a global WWW VL of DH projects, a place where crowdsourcing information worldwide.
I'll pass that on to the people here who worked on Intute (called HumBul before that), I'm sure they'll be glad to know they're missed. ;-) Getting funding to justify curated lists of resources was becoming increasingly difficult. To do this properly does take funding or highly motivated (and motivating) crowds.
http://arts-humanities.net/ was surely another attempt to do something similar.
-James
In this sense I have often suggested that giving Digital Object Identifiers to all digital outputs, including Digital Humanities resources like say AroundDDH would make them easier to aggregate, track, measure and share. Lack of sustainability of DH resources is as serious an issue as their discoverability.
It is worrying how many resources do not have the resources to follow good practices in digital preservation and discoverability, and over the years many not only do overlap but are left as funding runs out and those behind the projects move on to other projects. The cemetery of dead links can get busier and busier throughout time.
If we give ISBNs and ISSNs to all academic publications, and increasingly DOIs to online journal articles, a pervasive, standard identification number (a DOI) for other digital outputs should be no-brainer, but I still have to see even more public discussion about the need for this.
*Dr Ernesto Priego*Lecturer in Library Science #citylis City University London Editor-in-Chief, *The Comics Grid: Journal of Comics Scholarship * http://www.comicsgrid.com/ http://epriego.wordpress.com/ @ernestopriego https://twitter.com/ernestopriego
Taking Comics Seriously: http://www.city.ac.uk/news/2014/mar/taking-comics-seriously Subscribe to the Comics Grid Newsletter: http://eepurl.com/iOYAj
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 12:59 PM, James Cummings <James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk
wrote:
On 23/06/14 12:44, Noiret, Serge wrote:
So we are missing projects like Intute closed in 2011 (http://www.intute.ac.uk/) and we should have added a global Intute in DH for informing about the field’s developments, a global WWW VL of DH projects, a place where crowdsourcing information worldwide.
I'll pass that on to the people here who worked on Intute (called HumBul before that), I'm sure they'll be glad to know they're missed. ;-) Getting funding to justify curated lists of resources was becoming increasingly difficult. To do this properly does take funding or highly motivated (and motivating) crowds.
http://arts-humanities.net/ was surely another attempt to do something similar.
-James
-- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk Academic IT Services, University of Oxford
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Yes, I would say too that things like Intute are missed, but I am wondering if a crowdsourced catalogue (given the costs etc.) is the way to go or if we could not think of a different one, something like a more intelligent, dedicated search engine (after all Google is a generalist engine with an agenda), focused on disciplinary materials, using "semantics" perhaps. Maybe what should be crowdsourced is building-up the code for such an engine (using github or something similar).
Just a thought
Giorgio
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 1:59 PM, James Cummings James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk wrote:
On 23/06/14 12:44, Noiret, Serge wrote:
So we are missing projects like Intute closed in 2011 (http://www.intute.ac.uk/) and we should have added a global Intute in DH for informing about the field’s developments, a global WWW VL of DH projects, a place where crowdsourcing information worldwide.
I'll pass that on to the people here who worked on Intute (called HumBul before that), I'm sure they'll be glad to know they're missed. ;-) Getting funding to justify curated lists of resources was becoming increasingly difficult. To do this properly does take funding or highly motivated (and motivating) crowds.
http://arts-humanities.net/ was surely another attempt to do something similar.
-James
-- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk Academic IT Services, University of Oxford
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Hi all,
I agree with many of the fine points we make here. Thanks for the reminder to the list of projects like Intute and arts-humanities. It was very sad to see Intute go. I agree with Ernesto about the need for identifiers. That might prove tricky in the practice, but I'm all for it. In the meantime, we need other steps. Don't forget we are building a very different system of distribution, preservation and discoverability here, and we only have the preliminary scaffold!
Since I started working on AroundDH I have had many wonderful conversations with colleagues in DH, some in this list, some not, on the need for a curated catalog. DHCommons is definitely going in that direction. We recently had a conversation between Ryan Cordell, Elika Ortega, Elena Gonazalez-Blanco and Esteban Romero Frías (with Paul Spence in the background), about doing a prototype of a catalog for hispanophone projects. The ball is still on my court to come with a proposed *minimal* metadata model for sharing data amongst different cataloguing projects. This would lead to the sort of situation that Serge calls for below. I would be happy to share that model with the larger group, if there's interest, so we can have a broader conversation.
While we're at it, here are my two cents on best avenues for the future of curated lists to help us make sense of the global digital humanities: a) allow many trees to grow. that means making metadata collection for projects should try to meet some standards (that said. each of those trees can have their own google-like solution as Giorgio suggests; b) combine crowdsourced and team-based curation. the two are not mutually exclusive; c) design minimally so that the projects can survive without need for large budgets (arounddh has a budget of 0); d) use github; e) let's continue to build actual global networks of scholars who share interests and collaborate actively. that's the only way these catalogues will mean anything.
N.B. Ernesto, ha! I was just teasing about cheaters. Should I remove the joke? But yeah, to keep the suspense alive I wanted to push the data out after the whole thing is done. The thing also is that we haven't selected all the projects yet, so the data is very incomplete. Also, I want to do that minimal metadata model before I push, so it can actually be useful for conversation.
Thanks all for the wonderful conversation. I feel the project is already yielding some of its best results here.
All best, A.
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 8:31 AM, Giorgio Guzzetta guzzettg@gmail.com wrote:
Yes, I would say too that things like Intute are missed, but I am wondering if a crowdsourced catalogue (given the costs etc.) is the way to go or if we could not think of a different one, something like a more intelligent, dedicated search engine (after all Google is a generalist engine with an agenda), focused on disciplinary materials, using "semantics" perhaps. Maybe what should be crowdsourced is building-up the code for such an engine (using github or something similar).
Just a thought
Giorgio
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 1:59 PM, James Cummings < James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk> wrote:
On 23/06/14 12:44, Noiret, Serge wrote:
So we are missing projects like Intute closed in 2011 (http://www.intute.ac.uk/) and we should have added a global Intute in DH for informing about the field’s developments, a global WWW VL of DH projects, a place where crowdsourcing information worldwide.
I'll pass that on to the people here who worked on Intute (called HumBul before that), I'm sure they'll be glad to know they're missed. ;-) Getting funding to justify curated lists of resources was becoming increasingly difficult. To do this properly does take funding or highly motivated (and motivating) crowds.
http://arts-humanities.net/ was surely another attempt to do something similar.
-James
-- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk Academic IT Services, University of Oxford
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--
Par un curieux renversement qui est propre à notre temps, c'est l'innocence qui est sommée de fournir ses justifications (Albert Camus 1951)
Giorgio Guzzetta
PhD Student Digital Arts and Humanities Institute & Italian Department UCC
Books are falling apart http://futuread.hypotheses.org/ (blog in hypotheses.org)
Amnesia Creativa http://amnesiacreativa.giorgioguzzetta.net/
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Alex,
Wonderful project and, I think, excellent marketing to make an audience for the projects involve. Also I find the discussion here very interesting, especially for those like me that are working harder with tiny institutional support for long term projects.
Ernesto
2014-06-23 13:07 GMT-05:00 Alex Gil colibri.alex@gmail.com:
Hi all,
I agree with many of the fine points we make here. Thanks for the reminder to the list of projects like Intute and arts-humanities. It was very sad to see Intute go. I agree with Ernesto about the need for identifiers. That might prove tricky in the practice, but I'm all for it. In the meantime, we need other steps. Don't forget we are building a very different system of distribution, preservation and discoverability here, and we only have the preliminary scaffold!
Since I started working on AroundDH I have had many wonderful conversations with colleagues in DH, some in this list, some not, on the need for a curated catalog. DHCommons is definitely going in that direction. We recently had a conversation between Ryan Cordell, Elika Ortega, Elena Gonazalez-Blanco and Esteban Romero Frías (with Paul Spence in the background), about doing a prototype of a catalog for hispanophone projects. The ball is still on my court to come with a proposed *minimal* metadata model for sharing data amongst different cataloguing projects. This would lead to the sort of situation that Serge calls for below. I would be happy to share that model with the larger group, if there's interest, so we can have a broader conversation.
While we're at it, here are my two cents on best avenues for the future of curated lists to help us make sense of the global digital humanities: a) allow many trees to grow. that means making metadata collection for projects should try to meet some standards (that said. each of those trees can have their own google-like solution as Giorgio suggests; b) combine crowdsourced and team-based curation. the two are not mutually exclusive; c) design minimally so that the projects can survive without need for large budgets (arounddh has a budget of 0); d) use github; e) let's continue to build actual global networks of scholars who share interests and collaborate actively. that's the only way these catalogues will mean anything.
N.B. Ernesto, ha! I was just teasing about cheaters. Should I remove the joke? But yeah, to keep the suspense alive I wanted to push the data out after the whole thing is done. The thing also is that we haven't selected all the projects yet, so the data is very incomplete. Also, I want to do that minimal metadata model before I push, so it can actually be useful for conversation.
Thanks all for the wonderful conversation. I feel the project is already yielding some of its best results here.
All best, A.
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 8:31 AM, Giorgio Guzzetta guzzettg@gmail.com wrote:
Yes, I would say too that things like Intute are missed, but I am wondering if a crowdsourced catalogue (given the costs etc.) is the way to go or if we could not think of a different one, something like a more intelligent, dedicated search engine (after all Google is a generalist engine with an agenda), focused on disciplinary materials, using "semantics" perhaps. Maybe what should be crowdsourced is building-up the code for such an engine (using github or something similar).
Just a thought
Giorgio
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 1:59 PM, James Cummings < James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk> wrote:
On 23/06/14 12:44, Noiret, Serge wrote:
So we are missing projects like Intute closed in 2011 (http://www.intute.ac.uk/) and we should have added a global Intute in DH for informing about the field’s developments, a global WWW VL of DH projects, a place where crowdsourcing information worldwide.
I'll pass that on to the people here who worked on Intute (called HumBul before that), I'm sure they'll be glad to know they're missed. ;-) Getting funding to justify curated lists of resources was becoming increasingly difficult. To do this properly does take funding or highly motivated (and motivating) crowds.
http://arts-humanities.net/ was surely another attempt to do something similar.
-James
-- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk Academic IT Services, University of Oxford
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--
Par un curieux renversement qui est propre à notre temps, c'est l'innocence qui est sommée de fournir ses justifications (Albert Camus 1951)
Giorgio Guzzetta
PhD Student Digital Arts and Humanities Institute & Italian Department UCC
Books are falling apart http://futuread.hypotheses.org/ (blog in hypotheses.org)
Amnesia Creativa http://amnesiacreativa.giorgioguzzetta.net/
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Hi Alex, everyone,
Please don't remove the joke! I like the friendly style in which the About page is written; thank you for your explanation as well. Once the 80 days pass and you have a data set including the metadata it would be awesome if that could be shared as a citeable output on its own right (you could use the Columbia Commons repository and get a DOI for it, right?).
What's cool about releasing source datasets openly is that other folk can do more things with it, things we sometimes couldn't or hadn't thought of! Also I've realised the spreadsheet is actually available from the About page (was it there before and I missed it? I apologise if that was the case); which is amazing. Thanks for sharing that!
I agree that ineteroperable metadata will be key for easier aggregation and discoverability of DH resources in the future. In my view rather than working on a dedicated search engine it seems to me two of the keys are metadata and sustainability.
I am interested in finding out more about Github as a server-- I am excited about discovering http://jekyllrb.com/ and realised one can use Github to host sites. As a repository it is widely trusted amongst developers and I have seen more uptake from people in the humanities too.
All the best!
*Dr Ernesto Priego*Lecturer in Library Science #citylis City University London Editor-in-Chief, *The Comics Grid: Journal of Comics Scholarship * http://www.comicsgrid.com/ http://epriego.wordpress.com/ @ernestopriego https://twitter.com/ernestopriego
Taking Comics Seriously: http://www.city.ac.uk/news/2014/mar/taking-comics-seriously Subscribe to the Comics Grid Newsletter: http://eepurl.com/iOYAj
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 7:32 PM, Ernesto Priani epriani@gmail.com wrote:
Alex,
Wonderful project and, I think, excellent marketing to make an audience for the projects involve. Also I find the discussion here very interesting, especially for those like me that are working harder with tiny institutional support for long term projects.
Ernesto
2014-06-23 13:07 GMT-05:00 Alex Gil colibri.alex@gmail.com:
Hi all,
I agree with many of the fine points we make here. Thanks for the reminder to the list of projects like Intute and arts-humanities. It was very sad to see Intute go. I agree with Ernesto about the need for identifiers. That might prove tricky in the practice, but I'm all for it. In the meantime, we need other steps. Don't forget we are building a very different system of distribution, preservation and discoverability here, and we only have the preliminary scaffold!
Since I started working on AroundDH I have had many wonderful conversations with colleagues in DH, some in this list, some not, on the need for a curated catalog. DHCommons is definitely going in that direction. We recently had a conversation between Ryan Cordell, Elika Ortega, Elena Gonazalez-Blanco and Esteban Romero Frías (with Paul Spence in the background), about doing a prototype of a catalog for hispanophone projects. The ball is still on my court to come with a proposed *minimal* metadata model for sharing data amongst different cataloguing projects. This would lead to the sort of situation that Serge calls for below. I would be happy to share that model with the larger group, if there's interest, so we can have a broader conversation.
While we're at it, here are my two cents on best avenues for the future of curated lists to help us make sense of the global digital humanities: a) allow many trees to grow. that means making metadata collection for projects should try to meet some standards (that said. each of those trees can have their own google-like solution as Giorgio suggests; b) combine crowdsourced and team-based curation. the two are not mutually exclusive; c) design minimally so that the projects can survive without need for large budgets (arounddh has a budget of 0); d) use github; e) let's continue to build actual global networks of scholars who share interests and collaborate actively. that's the only way these catalogues will mean anything.
N.B. Ernesto, ha! I was just teasing about cheaters. Should I remove the joke? But yeah, to keep the suspense alive I wanted to push the data out after the whole thing is done. The thing also is that we haven't selected all the projects yet, so the data is very incomplete. Also, I want to do that minimal metadata model before I push, so it can actually be useful for conversation.
Thanks all for the wonderful conversation. I feel the project is already yielding some of its best results here.
All best, A.
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 8:31 AM, Giorgio Guzzetta guzzettg@gmail.com wrote:
Yes, I would say too that things like Intute are missed, but I am wondering if a crowdsourced catalogue (given the costs etc.) is the way to go or if we could not think of a different one, something like a more intelligent, dedicated search engine (after all Google is a generalist engine with an agenda), focused on disciplinary materials, using "semantics" perhaps. Maybe what should be crowdsourced is building-up the code for such an engine (using github or something similar).
Just a thought
Giorgio
On Mon, Jun 23, 2014 at 1:59 PM, James Cummings < James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk> wrote:
On 23/06/14 12:44, Noiret, Serge wrote:
So we are missing projects like Intute closed in 2011 (http://www.intute.ac.uk/) and we should have added a global Intute in DH for informing about the field’s developments, a global WWW VL of DH projects, a place where crowdsourcing information worldwide.
I'll pass that on to the people here who worked on Intute (called HumBul before that), I'm sure they'll be glad to know they're missed. ;-) Getting funding to justify curated lists of resources was becoming increasingly difficult. To do this properly does take funding or highly motivated (and motivating) crowds.
http://arts-humanities.net/ was surely another attempt to do something similar.
-James
-- Dr James Cummings, James.Cummings@it.ox.ac.uk Academic IT Services, University of Oxford
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--
Par un curieux renversement qui est propre à notre temps, c'est l'innocence qui est sommée de fournir ses justifications (Albert Camus 1951)
Giorgio Guzzetta
PhD Student Digital Arts and Humanities Institute & Italian Department UCC
Books are falling apart http://futuread.hypotheses.org/ (blog in hypotheses.org)
Amnesia Creativa http://amnesiacreativa.giorgioguzzetta.net/
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-- Escucha mi podcast Ráfagas de pensamiento http://ernestopriani.podbean.com/
Dr. Ernesto Priani Saisó www.ernestopriani.com Facultad de Filosofía y Letras, Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México Circuito interior, Ciudad Universitaria, S/N C.P. 04510 México, D.F. México
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-
Alex Gil -
Ernesto Priani -
Ernesto Priego -
Giorgio Guzzetta -
James Cummings -
Noiret, Serge