Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara bab995@mail.usask.cawrote:
Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos <marin.dacos@openedition.orgmailto:marin.dacos@openedition.org> wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara <bab995@mail.usask.camailto:bab995@mail.usask.ca> wrote: Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
_______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.camailto:globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.orghttp://www.openedition.org/ Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellencehttp://www.openedition.org/10221?lang=en (Equipex)
Nouvelle adresse postale : OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
Tél : 04 13 55 03 40 Tél. direct : 04 13 55 03 39 Fax : 04 13 55 03 41
Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.orgmailto:marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacoshttp://twitter.com/#%21/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.camailto:globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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What a great idea, Barbara. I'm willing to help!
It occurs to me that we could almost use a system, ironically enough, like the mechanical turk: I.e. set up a central bourse using something like conftool or open journal systems where papers could be submitted and people could volunteer to assist. That system would then handle the mechanics of pushing the papers out to volunteers and the comments back.
Marin raises a very good point about time and career-value--the more so since I still owe him a translation. And while I agree with you that people are good and willing to volunteer, it doesn't hurt to think about sustainability issues.
This raises a second possibility: I wonder if we could treat the bourse (if that was a good idea) as a new form of pre-print publishing: something like the way arXiv.org works for physicists: i.e. a lightly edited, but non-refereed place where people drop drafts before they submit to journals. If we used something like commentpress, then we could crowd source the english correction (and other things) in an open fashion. I'm on the executive of a group that is focussed on the future of the scholarly journal (force11.org) whose membership began in the sciences, I can ask them more about the arXiv model; and of course we have Marin, who is expert in all things scholarly communication here.
This is probably more than you are thinking of! But I think it would make sense to think of an infrastructure for handling the mechanics as easily as possible and the more it looks like a journal, the easier it is to extract credit (albeit minor credit) from all participants. I wonder if this is something the more Anglophone ADHO Constituent Organisations (e.g. ACH, CSDH/SCHN, aaDH) might want to adopt as a programme as well, encouraging their membership to contribute as public service.
On 13-08-28 07:49 AM, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote:
Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos <marin.dacos@openedition.org mailto:marin.dacos@openedition.org> wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara <bab995@mail.usask.ca mailto:bab995@mail.usask.ca> wrote:
Dear Colleagues, During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised. We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes. If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website. Thank you for your help, BB _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca <mailto:globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca> http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l You are currently subscribed to this list in NON-digest mode. This means you receive every message as it is posted. If this represents too much traffic, you can also subscribe in DIGEST mode. This sends out a single email once a day containing the entire day's postings. To change your settings go to http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/options/globaloutlookdh-l You can request a password reminder from this page if you have forgotten yours.-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.org http://www.openedition.org/ Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellence http://www.openedition.org/10221?lang=en**(Equipex)
*Nouvelle adresse postale :* OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
Tél : 04 13 55 03 40 Tél. direct : 04 13 55 03 39 Fax : 04 13 55 03 41
Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.org mailto:marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacos http://twitter.com/#%21/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca mailto:globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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I really like the idea of pre-print publishing: it gives a space to develop work and to gain some exposure. So, yes, please ask ahead about the arXiv model.
Any form of acknowledgement given for this work would be great and if it also handles the mechanics, then it is ideal.
There are many people in this list that are part of ADHO, I wonder if they would like to weigh on the matter of making it an official programme.
And thank you for volunteering!
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 10:27, Daniel O'Donnell <daniel.odonnell@uleth.camailto:daniel.odonnell@uleth.ca> wrote:
What a great idea, Barbara. I'm willing to help!
It occurs to me that we could almost use a system, ironically enough, like the mechanical turk: I.e. set up a central bourse using something like conftool or open journal systems where papers could be submitted and people could volunteer to assist. That system would then handle the mechanics of pushing the papers out to volunteers and the comments back.
Marin raises a very good point about time and career-value--the more so since I still owe him a translation. And while I agree with you that people are good and willing to volunteer, it doesn't hurt to think about sustainability issues.
This raises a second possibility: I wonder if we could treat the bourse (if that was a good idea) as a new form of pre-print publishing: something like the way arXiv.orghttp://arXiv.org works for physicists: i.e. a lightly edited, but non-refereed place where people drop drafts before they submit to journals. If we used something like commentpress, then we could crowd source the english correction (and other things) in an open fashion. I'm on the executive of a group that is focussed on the future of the scholarly journal (force11.orghttp://force11.org) whose membership began in the sciences, I can ask them more about the arXiv model; and of course we have Marin, who is expert in all things scholarly communication here.
This is probably more than you are thinking of! But I think it would make sense to think of an infrastructure for handling the mechanics as easily as possible and the more it looks like a journal, the easier it is to extract credit (albeit minor credit) from all participants. I wonder if this is something the more Anglophone ADHO Constituent Organisations (e.g. ACH, CSDH/SCHN, aaDH) might want to adopt as a programme as well, encouraging their membership to contribute as public service.
On 13-08-28 07:49 AM, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote: Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos <marin.dacos@openedition.orgmailto:marin.dacos@openedition.org> wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara <bab995@mail.usask.camailto:bab995@mail.usask.ca> wrote: Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
_______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.camailto:globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.orghttp://www.openedition.org/ Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellencehttp://www.openedition.org/10221?lang=en (Equipex)
Nouvelle adresse postale : OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
Tél : 04 13 55 03 40 Tél. direct : 04 13 55 03 39 Fax : 04 13 55 03 41
Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.orgmailto:marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacoshttp://twitter.com/#%21/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.camailto:globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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_______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.camailto:globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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-- --- Daniel Paul O'Donnell Professor of English University of Lethbridge Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4 Canada
+1 403 393-2539
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The debate brings to mind recent articles by women (!!) about (mere) editing as opposed to doing (proper) research: http://appositions.blogspot.com/2013/08/sheila-t-cavanagh-value-in-editorial... http://www.scholarlyediting.org/2013/essays/essay.2013presidentialaddress.ht... As well as the research of book historians, such as Anthony Grafton's Culture of Correction http://clio.cul.columbia.edu:7018/vwebv/holdingsInfo?bibId=10161621
Best wishes, Dagmar
Dagmar A. Riedel Center for Iranian Studies Columbia University https://researchblogs.cul.columbia.edu/islamicbooks/
On Wed, Aug 28, 2013 at 3:29 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara bab995@mail.usask.cawrote:
I really like the idea of pre-print publishing: it gives a space to develop work and to gain some exposure. So, yes, please ask ahead about the arXiv model.
Any form of acknowledgement given for this work would be great and if it also handles the mechanics, then it is ideal.
There are many people in this list that are part of ADHO, I wonder if they would like to weigh on the matter of making it an official programme.
And thank you for volunteering!
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 10:27, Daniel O'Donnell daniel.odonnell@uleth.ca wrote:
What a great idea, Barbara. I'm willing to help!
It occurs to me that we could almost use a system, ironically enough, like the mechanical turk: I.e. set up a central bourse using something like conftool or open journal systems where papers could be submitted and people could volunteer to assist. That system would then handle the mechanics of pushing the papers out to volunteers and the comments back.
Marin raises a very good point about time and career-value--the more so since I still owe him a translation. And while I agree with you that people are good and willing to volunteer, it doesn't hurt to think about sustainability issues.
This raises a second possibility: I wonder if we could treat the bourse (if that was a good idea) as a new form of pre-print publishing: something like the way arXiv.org works for physicists: i.e. a lightly edited, but non-refereed place where people drop drafts before they submit to journals. If we used something like commentpress, then we could crowd source the english correction (and other things) in an open fashion. I'm on the executive of a group that is focussed on the future of the scholarly journal (force11.org) whose membership began in the sciences, I can ask them more about the arXiv model; and of course we have Marin, who is expert in all things scholarly communication here.
This is probably more than you are thinking of! But I think it would make sense to think of an infrastructure for handling the mechanics as easily as possible and the more it looks like a journal, the easier it is to extract credit (albeit minor credit) from all participants. I wonder if this is something the more Anglophone ADHO Constituent Organisations (e.g. ACH, CSDH/SCHN, aaDH) might want to adopt as a programme as well, encouraging their membership to contribute as public service.
On 13-08-28 07:49 AM, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote:
Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos marin.dacos@openedition.org wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara bab995@mail.usask.cawrote:
Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.org Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellencehttp://www.openedition.org/10221?lang=en
- *(Equipex)
*Nouvelle adresse postale :* OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
Tél : 04 13 55 03 40 Tél. direct : 04 13 55 03 39 Fax : 04 13 55 03 41
Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacoshttp://twitter.com/#%21/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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globaloutlookdh-l mailing listglobaloutlookdh-l@uleth.cahttp://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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--
Daniel Paul O'Donnell Professor of English University of Lethbridge Lethbridge AB T1K 3M4 Canada +1 403 393-2539
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Justo ahora yo me encuentro en la situación del "gap" linguístico: Soy parte de un proyecto para sacar un libro con las ponencias de un congreso a través de una editorial británica. La mayoría de las autoras (fue un congreso de estudios de mujeres en Portugal) son luso o hispanohablantes. Tras año y medio de trabajo (seleccion, traducción, aceptación del proyecto por la editorial, edición, firma de contratos) nos rechasaron el original, porque "There are currently errors throughout". Por supuesto, ni se tomaron el trabajo de advertir en qué parte del libro están los errores. Y las autoras no estamos capacitadas para reconocerlos. ¿Dónde nos metemos ahora? Una parte del grupo está hablando de contratar revisión de modo colectivo, pero vivo en Cuba y me es imposible hacer aporte monetario alguno (mi salario y el bloqueo, ¡qué mezcla maravillosa!). Por encima de mi singularidad geopolítica, está de nuevo la hegemonía del inglés: necesitamos ese libro para entrar a los índices "importantes", pero no podemos negociar con la editorial, ¿alguna solución?
---------------------------------------------
Just now I´m in an idiomatic gap. I´m part of a proyect to publish a book with a congress papers in a british editorial. Most of us (it was a congress of women studies at Portugal) spoke/write spanish or portugues (¿?). After a year and a alf of work (selection, translation, arrangement with the publishers, edition, contracts) the original was reyected because "There are currently errors throughout". Of course, they are to busy to say were are the errors, and as non-english speakers we are not calified to recognice that kind of thing. What are we going to do now? A part of the group is considering a contract to get a fully reviewed version, but I live in Cuba, and I can´t afford that (my income and the USA embargo, wonderfull mixture!). Beyond the geopolitics singularity of my cincunstances, this is, again, an issue about english hegemony: we need the book to get in to the "important index", buy we are not able to negotiate with the publishing house. Any idea?
Yasmín S. Portales Machado -------------------------------------- Marxista, Feminista y Bloguera
Twitter: @nimlothdecuba Facebook http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=663817529 Mi blog: http://yasminsilvia.blogspot.com/
Parte de Proyecto Arcoiris Colectivo LGBT de Cuba, anticapitalista e independiente http://proyectoarcoiris.wordpress.com/
Parte de Observatorio Crítico de Cuba ¡A la izquierda, pero por la izquierda! http://observatoriocriticodesdecuba.wordpress.com/
"El feminismo ha puesto en evidencia, mejor que ninguna otra corriente de pensamiento, tanto la arbitrariedad del psicoanálisis como la insuficiencia del marxismo, es decir, ha cuestionado los dos grandes modelos totalizadores del siglo XX." Carlo Frabetti
How much is DH part of this publication project?! It may be possible and sensible to solicit help from the DH community on the DHcommons: http://dhcommons.org/help-type/other since other projects are asking for help with various forms of proofreading.
--DAR
2013/8/30 Yasmín S. Portales Machado yasmin@cubarte.cult.cu
**
Justo ahora yo me encuentro en la situación del "gap" linguístico: Soy parte de un proyecto para sacar un libro con las ponencias de un congreso a través de una editorial británica. La mayoría de las autoras (fue un congreso de estudios de mujeres en Portugal) son luso o hispanohablantes. Tras año y medio de trabajo (seleccion, traducción, aceptación del proyecto por la editorial, edición, firma de contratos) nos rechasaron el original, porque "There are currently errors throughout". Por supuesto, ni se tomaron el trabajo de advertir en qué parte del libro están los errores. Y las autoras no estamos capacitadas para reconocerlos. ¿Dónde nos metemos ahora? Una parte del grupo está hablando de contratar revisión de modo colectivo, pero vivo en Cuba y me es imposible hacer aporte monetario alguno (mi salario y el bloqueo, ¡qué mezcla maravillosa!). Por encima de mi singularidad geopolítica, está de nuevo la hegemonía del inglés: necesitamos ese libro para entrar a los índices "importantes", pero no podemos negociar con la editorial, ¿alguna solución?
Just now I´m in an idiomatic gap. I´m part of a proyect to publish a book with a congress papers in a british editorial. Most of us (it was a congress of women studies at Portugal) spoke/write spanish or portugues (¿?). After a year and a alf of work (selection, translation, arrangement with the publishers, edition, contracts) the original was reyected because "There are currently errors throughout". Of course, they are to busy to say were are the errors, and as non-english speakers we are not calified to recognice that kind of thing. What are we going to do now? A part of the group is considering a contract to get a fully reviewed version, but I live in Cuba, and I can´t afford that (my income and the USA embargo, wonderfull mixture!). Beyond the geopolitics singularity of my cincunstances, this is, again, an issue about english hegemony: we need the book to get in to the "important index", buy we are not able to negotiate with the publishing house. Any idea?
Yasmín S. Portales Machado
Marxista, Feminista y Bloguera
Twitter: @nimlothdecuba Facebook http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=663817529 Mi blog: http://yasminsilvia.blogspot.com/
Parte de Proyecto Arcoiris Colectivo LGBT de Cuba, anticapitalista e independiente http://proyectoarcoiris.wordpress.com/
Parte de Observatorio Crítico de Cuba ¡A la izquierda, pero por la izquierda! http://observatoriocriticodesdecuba.wordpress.com/
"El feminismo ha puesto en evidencia, mejor que ninguna otra corriente de pensamiento, tanto la arbitrariedad del psicoanálisis como la insuficiencia del marxismo, es decir, ha cuestionado los dos grandes modelos totalizadores del siglo XX." Carlo Frabetti
globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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At the moment, I'm working with Dennis Tenen and others to bring Thuan Huynh's TraduWiki http://traduwiki.org/ platform* to bear on projects like this. Stay tuned for more as Thuan wraps up work on the next iteration of TraduWiki and we work out the kinks of what we're calling for now the Traduwiki Foundation. One of our hopes is that the platform could work in a way that allows scholars to write in the language they feel strongest and that communities of translation will form around their work. I did not want to let the cat out of the bag just yet, but I feel we can get the conversation started.
If we wanted both possibilities, both to translate or to adapt global English to mainstream academy standards, we might be talking about two platforms. The new version of the platform will allow for user permissions that can keep some work private and some public, depending on your preference. What the platform solves is the problem of assignment and commitment.
I would love to work with the Translation Commons working group on this initiative. It would help if we could find some beta testers ready to play this year. We are also and keenly looking for folks who are willing to try translation experiments in the classroom.
*N.B. Note that this is the old version of the platform. The new version has been improved in many ways by the conversations we've had since the launch of GO::DH.
Best, A.
On Fri, Aug 30, 2013 at 12:58 PM, Dagmar Riedel <islamicbookcensus@gmail.com
wrote:
How much is DH part of this publication project?! It may be possible and sensible to solicit help from the DH community on the DHcommons: http://dhcommons.org/help-type/other since other projects are asking for help with various forms of proofreading.
--DAR
2013/8/30 Yasmín S. Portales Machado yasmin@cubarte.cult.cu
**
Justo ahora yo me encuentro en la situación del "gap" linguístico: Soy parte de un proyecto para sacar un libro con las ponencias de un congreso a través de una editorial británica. La mayoría de las autoras (fue un congreso de estudios de mujeres en Portugal) son luso o hispanohablantes. Tras año y medio de trabajo (seleccion, traducción, aceptación del proyecto por la editorial, edición, firma de contratos) nos rechasaron el original, porque "There are currently errors throughout". Por supuesto, ni se tomaron el trabajo de advertir en qué parte del libro están los errores. Y las autoras no estamos capacitadas para reconocerlos. ¿Dónde nos metemos ahora? Una parte del grupo está hablando de contratar revisión de modo colectivo, pero vivo en Cuba y me es imposible hacer aporte monetario alguno (mi salario y el bloqueo, ¡qué mezcla maravillosa!). Por encima de mi singularidad geopolítica, está de nuevo la hegemonía del inglés: necesitamos ese libro para entrar a los índices "importantes", pero no podemos negociar con la editorial, ¿alguna solución?
Just now I´m in an idiomatic gap. I´m part of a proyect to publish a book with a congress papers in a british editorial. Most of us (it was a congress of women studies at Portugal) spoke/write spanish or portugues (¿?). After a year and a alf of work (selection, translation, arrangement with the publishers, edition, contracts) the original was reyected because "There are currently errors throughout". Of course, they are to busy to say were are the errors, and as non-english speakers we are not calified to recognice that kind of thing. What are we going to do now? A part of the group is considering a contract to get a fully reviewed version, but I live in Cuba, and I can´t afford that (my income and the USA embargo, wonderfull mixture!). Beyond the geopolitics singularity of my cincunstances, this is, again, an issue about english hegemony: we need the book to get in to the "important index", buy we are not able to negotiate with the publishing house. Any idea?
Yasmín S. Portales Machado
Marxista, Feminista y Bloguera
Twitter: @nimlothdecuba Facebook http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=663817529 Mi blog: http://yasminsilvia.blogspot.com/
Parte de Proyecto Arcoiris Colectivo LGBT de Cuba, anticapitalista e independiente http://proyectoarcoiris.wordpress.com/
Parte de Observatorio Crítico de Cuba ¡A la izquierda, pero por la izquierda! http://observatoriocriticodesdecuba.wordpress.com/
"El feminismo ha puesto en evidencia, mejor que ninguna otra corriente de pensamiento, tanto la arbitrariedad del psicoanálisis como la insuficiencia del marxismo, es decir, ha cuestionado los dos grandes modelos totalizadores del siglo XX." Carlo Frabetti
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Dear all,
All initiatives going in this direction are very important. In France, a new project close to TraduWiki is called TLHUB. http://tlhub.org/en
We (OpenEdition) will test it and give some feedback.
Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 30, 2013 at 9:37 PM, Alex Gil colibri.alex@gmail.com wrote:
At the moment, I'm working with Dennis Tenen and others to bring Thuan Huynh's TraduWiki http://traduwiki.org/ platform* to bear on projects like this. Stay tuned for more as Thuan wraps up work on the next iteration of TraduWiki and we work out the kinks of what we're calling for now the Traduwiki Foundation. One of our hopes is that the platform could work in a way that allows scholars to write in the language they feel strongest and that communities of translation will form around their work. I did not want to let the cat out of the bag just yet, but I feel we can get the conversation started.
If we wanted both possibilities, both to translate or to adapt global English to mainstream academy standards, we might be talking about two platforms. The new version of the platform will allow for user permissions that can keep some work private and some public, depending on your preference. What the platform solves is the problem of assignment and commitment.
I would love to work with the Translation Commons working group on this initiative. It would help if we could find some beta testers ready to play this year. We are also and keenly looking for folks who are willing to try translation experiments in the classroom.
*N.B. Note that this is the old version of the platform. The new version has been improved in many ways by the conversations we've had since the launch of GO::DH.
Best, A.
On Fri, Aug 30, 2013 at 12:58 PM, Dagmar Riedel < islamicbookcensus@gmail.com> wrote:
How much is DH part of this publication project?! It may be possible and sensible to solicit help from the DH community on the DHcommons: http://dhcommons.org/help-type/other since other projects are asking for help with various forms of proofreading.
--DAR
2013/8/30 Yasmín S. Portales Machado yasmin@cubarte.cult.cu
**
Justo ahora yo me encuentro en la situación del "gap" linguístico: Soy parte de un proyecto para sacar un libro con las ponencias de un congreso a través de una editorial británica. La mayoría de las autoras (fue un congreso de estudios de mujeres en Portugal) son luso o hispanohablantes. Tras año y medio de trabajo (seleccion, traducción, aceptación del proyecto por la editorial, edición, firma de contratos) nos rechasaron el original, porque "There are currently errors throughout". Por supuesto, ni se tomaron el trabajo de advertir en qué parte del libro están los errores. Y las autoras no estamos capacitadas para reconocerlos. ¿Dónde nos metemos ahora? Una parte del grupo está hablando de contratar revisión de modo colectivo, pero vivo en Cuba y me es imposible hacer aporte monetario alguno (mi salario y el bloqueo, ¡qué mezcla maravillosa!). Por encima de mi singularidad geopolítica, está de nuevo la hegemonía del inglés: necesitamos ese libro para entrar a los índices "importantes", pero no podemos negociar con la editorial, ¿alguna solución?
Just now I´m in an idiomatic gap. I´m part of a proyect to publish a book with a congress papers in a british editorial. Most of us (it was a congress of women studies at Portugal) spoke/write spanish or portugues (¿?). After a year and a alf of work (selection, translation, arrangement with the publishers, edition, contracts) the original was reyected because "There are currently errors throughout". Of course, they are to busy to say were are the errors, and as non-english speakers we are not calified to recognice that kind of thing. What are we going to do now? A part of the group is considering a contract to get a fully reviewed version, but I live in Cuba, and I can´t afford that (my income and the USA embargo, wonderfull mixture!). Beyond the geopolitics singularity of my cincunstances, this is, again, an issue about english hegemony: we need the book to get in to the "important index", buy we are not able to negotiate with the publishing house. Any idea?
Yasmín S. Portales Machado
Marxista, Feminista y Bloguera
Twitter: @nimlothdecuba Facebook http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=663817529 Mi blog: http://yasminsilvia.blogspot.com/
Parte de Proyecto Arcoiris Colectivo LGBT de Cuba, anticapitalista e independiente http://proyectoarcoiris.wordpress.com/
Parte de Observatorio Crítico de Cuba ¡A la izquierda, pero por la izquierda! http://observatoriocriticodesdecuba.wordpress.com/
"El feminismo ha puesto en evidencia, mejor que ninguna otra corriente de pensamiento, tanto la arbitrariedad del psicoanálisis como la insuficiencia del marxismo, es decir, ha cuestionado los dos grandes modelos totalizadores del siglo XX." Carlo Frabetti
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Dear Jasmin,
thanks for reporting your disappointing experience with the British publisher. We had a very similar problem with the English translation of our book "L'umanista digitale" (Il Mulino, 2010), an introduction to DH that has selled more than 2000 copies in Italy and was already reprinted. An American publisher in 2010 asked us to translate the volume, and after a lengthy negotiation we signed a contract in 2011. I think I've already told the story... anyway although the translation was made by a professional native speaker, the publisher replied six months later that "it was not idiomatic". I wonder how a translation from Italian into English could ever be "idiomatic", but that is not the problem. The problem was what the publisher was *expecting*: probably an "American" book. In fact, the first review confirmed the impression of a huge (but typical) cultural misunderstanding. For example it is clear that our vision of DH *is not* the vision currently popular in the Anglo-America world, so the reviewer did not perceive our point of view as useful or necessary to the DH debate.
So, yes, working on our linguistic gaps would of great help. But please let's not delude ourselves. Where is the power? Who does rule the current lingua franca? Until the rhetorical and discursive standards will be set by an élite of British and American scholars and their connected "international" publishers, a real -- and *equal* -- cultural exchange and progress will be not possible.
All the best
Domenico
2013/8/30 Yasmín S. Portales Machado yasmin@cubarte.cult.cu:
Justo ahora yo me encuentro en la situación del "gap" linguístico: Soy parte de un proyecto para sacar un libro con las ponencias de un congreso a través de una editorial británica. La mayoría de las autoras (fue un congreso de estudios de mujeres en Portugal) son luso o hispanohablantes. Tras año y medio de trabajo (seleccion, traducción, aceptación del proyecto por la editorial, edición, firma de contratos) nos rechasaron el original, porque "There are currently errors throughout". Por supuesto, ni se tomaron el trabajo de advertir en qué parte del libro están los errores. Y las autoras no estamos capacitadas para reconocerlos. ¿Dónde nos metemos ahora? Una parte del grupo está hablando de contratar revisión de modo colectivo, pero vivo en Cuba y me es imposible hacer aporte monetario alguno (mi salario y el bloqueo, ¡qué mezcla maravillosa!). Por encima de mi singularidad geopolítica, está de nuevo la hegemonía del inglés: necesitamos ese libro para entrar a los índices "importantes", pero no podemos negociar con la editorial, ¿alguna solución?
Just now I´m in an idiomatic gap. I´m part of a proyect to publish a book with a congress papers in a british editorial. Most of us (it was a congress of women studies at Portugal) spoke/write spanish or portugues (¿?). After a year and a alf of work (selection, translation, arrangement with the publishers, edition, contracts) the original was reyected because "There are currently errors throughout". Of course, they are to busy to say were are the errors, and as non-english speakers we are not calified to recognice that kind of thing. What are we going to do now? A part of the group is considering a contract to get a fully reviewed version, but I live in Cuba, and I can´t afford that (my income and the USA embargo, wonderfull mixture!). Beyond the geopolitics singularity of my cincunstances, this is, again, an issue about english hegemony: we need the book to get in to the "important index", buy we are not able to negotiate with the publishing house. Any idea?
Yasmín S. Portales Machado
Marxista, Feminista y Bloguera
Twitter: @nimlothdecuba Facebook http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=663817529 Mi blog: http://yasminsilvia.blogspot.com/
Parte de Proyecto Arcoiris Colectivo LGBT de Cuba, anticapitalista e independiente http://proyectoarcoiris.wordpress.com/
Parte de Observatorio Crítico de Cuba ¡A la izquierda, pero por la izquierda! http://observatoriocriticodesdecuba.wordpress.com/
"El feminismo ha puesto en evidencia, mejor que ninguna otra corriente de pensamiento, tanto la arbitrariedad del psicoanálisis como la insuficiencia del marxismo, es decir, ha cuestionado los dos grandes modelos totalizadores del siglo XX." Carlo Frabetti
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Dear Barbara, and all,
This is an important initiative and one possible solution to a difficult problem. For my first ten years of publishing in English I had a very helpful friend; Norwegian but with a master in English, to proof-read everything I published at any serious level. Especially the first years there were few lines of text without at least one correction. And I grew up in Norway, one of the countries were English is seen and heard every day; we had it as our first foreign language in school and most textbooks at university were in English.
Two lessons to learn, at least. The first is that even in a rich society with strong ties to UK and USA, we still have to make a very significant effort to match what many people with English as their mother tongue have as a starting point (not all, of course; there are class differences, learning difficulties, and much more in English speaking countries as well, of course). And second, friends are good to have - but useful friends in this area are more likely to be found in a country such as Norway, with the strong ties to the English speaking world, than in many other countries.
What you are suggesting is, in a way, extending the circles for friendly assistance to people who are not friend in a traditional sense, crossing national borders as part of the process. I like that idea.
Kind regards,
Øyvind
On 28. aug. 2013, at 13:49, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote:
Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos marin.dacos@openedition.org wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara bab995@mail.usask.ca wrote: Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.org Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellence (Equipex)
Nouvelle adresse postale : OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
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Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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I think, if nothing else, that we should get this set up as a working group (Barbara, you know how to do it, right?). This is the kind of thing where you want the network to be obvious to newcomers, so they know how to get in.
Still in love with this idea.
On 13-09-02 11:45 AM, Øyvind Eide wrote:
Dear Barbara, and all,
This is an important initiative and one possible solution to a difficult problem. For my first ten years of publishing in English I had a very helpful friend; Norwegian but with a master in English, to proof-read everything I published at any serious level. Especially the first years there were few lines of text without at least one correction. And I grew up in Norway, one of the countries were English is seen and heard every day; we had it as our first foreign language in school and most textbooks at university were in English.
Two lessons to learn, at least. The first is that even in a rich society with strong ties to UK and USA, we still have to make a very significant effort to match what many people with English as their mother tongue have as a starting point (not all, of course; there are class differences, learning difficulties, and much more in English speaking countries as well, of course). And second, friends are good to have - but useful friends in this area are more likely to be found in a country such as Norway, with the strong ties to the English speaking world, than in many other countries.
What you are suggesting is, in a way, extending the circles for friendly assistance to people who are not friend in a traditional sense, crossing national borders as part of the process. I like that idea.
Kind regards,
Øyvind
On 28. aug. 2013, at 13:49, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote:
Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos marin.dacos@openedition.org wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara bab995@mail.usask.ca wrote: Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.org Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellence (Equipex)
Nouvelle adresse postale : OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
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Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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Yes, as Alex mentions, we have the GO::DH Translation Commons working grouphttp://www.globaloutlookdh.org/working-groups/translation-commons/(which so far has been fairly dormant), and I think this kind of collaboration would fit right within its purview. Right now, the working group page includes a form for volunteers interested in translating content on the GO::DH website, but this could be broadened to invite other forms of participation.
TraduWiki sounds like it could be a great solution. I also wonder whether having something like a http://stackexchange.com/ site could be helpful for certain kinds of immediate issues or inquiries.
Best, Tim
-- Tim A. Thompson Metadata Librarian University of Miami Libraries 1300 Memorial Drive Coral Gables, Florida 33124 www.library.miami.edu
(305) 284-1827 (office) (201) 423-9972 (mobile) www.linkedin.com/in/timathompson t.thompson5@miami.edu
On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 5:11 PM, Daniel O'Donnell daniel.odonnell@uleth.cawrote:
I think, if nothing else, that we should get this set up as a working group (Barbara, you know how to do it, right?). This is the kind of thing where you want the network to be obvious to newcomers, so they know how to get in.
Still in love with this idea.
On 13-09-02 11:45 AM, Øyvind Eide wrote:
Dear Barbara, and all,
This is an important initiative and one possible solution to a difficult problem. For my first ten years of publishing in English I had a very helpful friend; Norwegian but with a master in English, to proof-read everything I published at any serious level. Especially the first years there were few lines of text without at least one correction. And I grew up in Norway, one of the countries were English is seen and heard every day; we had it as our first foreign language in school and most textbooks at university were in English.
Two lessons to learn, at least. The first is that even in a rich society with strong ties to UK and USA, we still have to make a very significant effort to match what many people with English as their mother tongue have as a starting point (not all, of course; there are class differences, learning difficulties, and much more in English speaking countries as well, of course). And second, friends are good to have - but useful friends in this area are more likely to be found in a country such as Norway, with the strong ties to the English speaking world, than in many other countries.
What you are suggesting is, in a way, extending the circles for friendly assistance to people who are not friend in a traditional sense, crossing national borders as part of the process. I like that idea.
Kind regards,
Øyvind
On 28. aug. 2013, at 13:49, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote:
Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos marin.dacos@openedition.org wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable,
because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara < bab995@mail.usask.ca> wrote: Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
______________________________**_________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/**mailman/listinfo/**globaloutlookdh-lhttp://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.org Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellence (Equipex)
Nouvelle adresse postale : OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
Tél : 04 13 55 03 40 Tél. direct : 04 13 55 03 39 Fax : 04 13 55 03 41
Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin ______________________________**_________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/**mailman/listinfo/**globaloutlookdh-lhttp://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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Good morning all,
I will work with Dennis Tenen on my return to the United States on Monday to make a formal proposal to the group around TraduWiki. Stay tuned.
The StackExchange idea can be useful for smaller pieces. I know Dennis has been interested in this kind of space for similar issues. Looking forward to hear more.
A.
On Tue, Sep 3, 2013 at 7:33 PM, Tim Thompson timathom@gmail.com wrote:
Yes, as Alex mentions, we have the GO::DH Translation Commons working group http://www.globaloutlookdh.org/working-groups/translation-commons/(which so far has been fairly dormant), and I think this kind of collaboration would fit right within its purview. Right now, the working group page includes a form for volunteers interested in translating content on the GO::DH website, but this could be broadened to invite other forms of participation.
TraduWiki sounds like it could be a great solution. I also wonder whether having something like a http://stackexchange.com/ site could be helpful for certain kinds of immediate issues or inquiries.
Best, Tim
-- Tim A. Thompson Metadata Librarian University of Miami Libraries 1300 Memorial Drive Coral Gables, Florida 33124 www.library.miami.edu
(305) 284-1827 (office) (201) 423-9972 (mobile) www.linkedin.com/in/timathompson t.thompson5@miami.edu
On Mon, Sep 2, 2013 at 5:11 PM, Daniel O'Donnell <daniel.odonnell@uleth.ca
wrote:
I think, if nothing else, that we should get this set up as a working group (Barbara, you know how to do it, right?). This is the kind of thing where you want the network to be obvious to newcomers, so they know how to get in.
Still in love with this idea.
On 13-09-02 11:45 AM, Øyvind Eide wrote:
Dear Barbara, and all,
This is an important initiative and one possible solution to a difficult problem. For my first ten years of publishing in English I had a very helpful friend; Norwegian but with a master in English, to proof-read everything I published at any serious level. Especially the first years there were few lines of text without at least one correction. And I grew up in Norway, one of the countries were English is seen and heard every day; we had it as our first foreign language in school and most textbooks at university were in English.
Two lessons to learn, at least. The first is that even in a rich society with strong ties to UK and USA, we still have to make a very significant effort to match what many people with English as their mother tongue have as a starting point (not all, of course; there are class differences, learning difficulties, and much more in English speaking countries as well, of course). And second, friends are good to have - but useful friends in this area are more likely to be found in a country such as Norway, with the strong ties to the English speaking world, than in many other countries.
What you are suggesting is, in a way, extending the circles for friendly assistance to people who are not friend in a traditional sense, crossing national borders as part of the process. I like that idea.
Kind regards,
Øyvind
On 28. aug. 2013, at 13:49, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote:
Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos marin.dacos@openedition.org wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable,
because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara < bab995@mail.usask.ca> wrote: Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
______________________________**_________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/**mailman/listinfo/**globaloutlookdh-lhttp://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.org Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellence (Equipex)
Nouvelle adresse postale : OpenEdition - 38 Rue Frédéric Joliot Curie - F - 13013 Marseille Cedex 20
Tél : 04 13 55 03 40 Tél. direct : 04 13 55 03 39 Fax : 04 13 55 03 41
Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin ______________________________**_________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/**mailman/listinfo/**globaloutlookdh-lhttp://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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Yes, I know what to do.
I will get to it in the next couple of days.
BB
On 2 Sep 2013, at 15:11, Daniel O'Donnell daniel.odonnell@uleth.ca wrote:
I think, if nothing else, that we should get this set up as a working group (Barbara, you know how to do it, right?). This is the kind of thing where you want the network to be obvious to newcomers, so they know how to get in.
Still in love with this idea.
On 13-09-02 11:45 AM, Øyvind Eide wrote:
Dear Barbara, and all,
This is an important initiative and one possible solution to a difficult problem. For my first ten years of publishing in English I had a very helpful friend; Norwegian but with a master in English, to proof-read everything I published at any serious level. Especially the first years there were few lines of text without at least one correction. And I grew up in Norway, one of the countries were English is seen and heard every day; we had it as our first foreign language in school and most textbooks at university were in English.
Two lessons to learn, at least. The first is that even in a rich society with strong ties to UK and USA, we still have to make a very significant effort to match what many people with English as their mother tongue have as a starting point (not all, of course; there are class differences, learning difficulties, and much more in English speaking countries as well, of course). And second, friends are good to have - but useful friends in this area are more likely to be found in a country such as Norway, with the strong ties to the English speaking world, than in many other countries.
What you are suggesting is, in a way, extending the circles for friendly assistance to people who are not friend in a traditional sense, crossing national borders as part of the process. I like that idea.
Kind regards,
Øyvind
On 28. aug. 2013, at 13:49, Bordalejo, Barbara wrote:
Dear Marin,
I can see why you have doubts, however I have a some volunteers already. There are other tasks that might be more valued in academia, but perhaps we should see collegiality and inclusion, and those who seek and promote them, as valuable too. Some scholars already act in this generous way, although perhaps not yet by helping to bridge the language gap. Several years ago, I was told that if I ever saw an academic in a position of power and couldn't immediately spot tangible merits, that I should look at his or her record on speed and reliability of peer-review completion, reference letter writing and other contributions to academia.
I am still looking for volunteers for any language people feel they can contribute to review. And I have been thinking that if this becomes a large enough enterprise, there should be a site where volunteers can sign up and be found.
In the meantime, I want to thank all of those who already put their names forward. I am sure that they know this already but I want to say it anyway: your participation matters, your actions matter and I, personally, feel grateful to find that members of this community have so much to give and such willingness to do so.
All the best,
BB
On 28 Aug 2013, at 05:29, Marin Dacos marin.dacos@openedition.org wrote:
This is a very interesting proposal. I am not sure if is doable, because it will become a heavy task to do for native speakers, and these task will be in competition with other, much more valuated in the acadamy, such as writing books or articles for their own. How could we solve this issue? Best regards, Marin
On Fri, Aug 23, 2013 at 8:39 PM, Bordalejo, Barbara bab995@mail.usask.ca wrote: Dear Colleagues,
During the last few weeks I have reviewed some articles (all in English) by non-native speakers. Some times they are almost perfect, some others they are far from it. I know that my own texts suffer the same problems. Clearly, this is a factor that keeps scholars, who are not native speakers of English, marginalised.
We had a similar discussion on the subject of the Anglo-American (and Canadian) hegemony in the field, but I don't recall a concrete solution being offered. In any case, I have an idea that might be helpful. I was wondering whether I could ask those of you with native or near-native English skills to volunteer to proof articles to avoid rejections based on bad expression or avoidable mistakes.
If you think that you can contribute to this, send me an e-mail and I will compile a list of volunteers to put in the GO::DH website.
Thank you for your help,
BB
globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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-- Marin Dacos - http://www.openedition.org Director - Centre for Open Electronic Publishing - CNRS - EHESS - Aix-Marseille Université (AMU) - Université d'Avignon OpenEdition is now a Facility of Excellence (Equipex)
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Skype : marin.dacos - Google hangout : marin.dacos@openedition.org Twitter [FR] : http://twitter.com/marindacos Twitter [EN] : http://twitter.com/openmarin _______________________________________________ globaloutlookdh-l mailing list globaloutlookdh-l@uleth.ca http://listserv.uleth.ca/mailman/listinfo/globaloutlookdh-l
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Alex Gil -
Bordalejo, Barbara -
Dagmar Riedel -
Daniel O'Donnell -
Domenico Fiormonte -
Marin Dacos -
Tim Thompson -
Yasmín S. Portales Machado -
Øyvind Eide